Machaceh is pointing...

[Huntingonthebrain]

I made what seems to be an amazing discovery (sarcasm). If I work my dog into the wind....he is more likely to start pointing a lot farther from the bird :doh: . I was starting to get a little disappointed because he seemed to want to sight point everytime. My last 2 runs with him today were a huge success. He caught the scent and stopped (still needed a quick WHOA to get him to stop up) . I then dropped the leash beside him. He was approximately 15' from the bird. I then went in and gave the pigeon a little boot to flush it. as the bird was taking off. I told him to whoa and he hardly moved. Things are moving along nicely. :cool__1:

[ChrisGSP]

Congrats on your work with the dog.

I'm waiting for my dog to do that!


Chris

[Huntingonthebrain]

as I said... make sure you work the dog right into the wind towards the bird. The other thing I have been doing is leaving the crate that I keep the pigeons in, out in the backyard so that dog can smell'em. He gets interested sniffs them for a while and then runs and plays and then comes back again and smells again for a while. Everytime he looks like he has the scent while training or playing I praise him for it

[Jixer]

HuntingOnTheBrain. Glad he is pointing for you. I would still work him cross wind for best conditions. Instead of going straight to the bird, try quartering to the bird ie zig-zig towards it to make him cover more ground on his way in.

Crosswind has the advantage that you will know exactly when he catches scent. His head will turn, and his direction will change.

[Huntingonthebrain]

That make sense.. I will try that.

[Huntingonthebrain]

You guys and gals might get bored of this, but I am gonna keep posting updates on my dog training anyway. Last night took Machaceh out for some training again. I decided just for fun I would take the gun along as well and test how he responded to the gun going off when he was in a point. He responded amazingly. He didn't move. I was about 4' from him when I fired the 12 gauge into the air. Now I just need to get him to stop moving when I flush the bird. He is starting to get that as well though.
On another training note. I am impressed with how he is starting to use his nose. I had setup so that the dog and I were downwind from the pigeon (pigeon SE of myself and the dog) with the wind angled towards us (from the SE). So we were not totally working cross wind but sort of. As I let the dog go and started to walk (moving south) I noticed that the wind had actually changed direction it was now angling away from me( it was a SE wind and had changed to NE). The dog walked by the bird (he was about 10' away but missed the scent because of the wind change) and then stopped and caught the scent coming from the NE and he turned and began to search for the bird using the newly found scent. When I knew he had caught the scent for sure. I told him to WHOA. It was amazing. This is what I have been hoping would happen. We are in business. Pheasant hunting in the fall.... here I come. I got some work to do still but I should be ready

[andrew06]

I am definatly not getting sick of your training talks.. Its nice to hear how things go throughout the process not just what went wrong and how to fix it. Alot of the same hurdles you have had in training I can relate with my GSP. I've been learning alot just reading not to mention its great motivation!! Andrew

[Jixer]

You guys and gals might get bored of this, but I am gonna keep posting updates on my dog training anyway. Last night took Machaceh out for some training again. I decided just for fun I would take the gun along as well and test how he responded to the gun going off when he was in a point. He responded amazingly. He didn't move. I was about 4' from him when I fired the 12 gauge into the air. Now I just need to get him to stop moving when I flush the bird. He is starting to get that as well though.
On another training note. I am impressed with how he is starting to use his nose. I had setup so that the dog and I were downwind from the pigeon (pigeon SE of myself and the dog) with the wind angled towards us (from the SE). So we were not totally working cross wind but sort of. As I let the dog go and started to walk (moving south) I noticed that the wind had actually changed direction it was now angling away from me( it was a SE wind and had changed to NE). The dog walked by the bird (he was about 10' away but missed the scent because of the wind change) and then stopped and caught the scent coming from the NE and he turned and began to search for the bird using the newly found scent. When I knew he had caught the scent for sure. I told him to WHOA. It was amazing. This is what I have been hoping would happen. We are in business. Pheasant hunting in the fall.... here I come. I got some work to do still but I should be ready



Only 14 weeks to go till Pheasant season... Not that I am counting!:clap2:
Keep up the good work. You will be well rewarded for it the first time you get a bird over him.

[Huntingonthebrain]

Thanks for the encouragement Andrew. I am excited that I am actually doing this training myself. I am really glad that is working actually. Wow 14 weeks.. i got some work to do. I hope to get him out once this week and perhaps a few times next week as I will be on vacation. I guess I am not sure as to when I should move him to the next stage. I think that he is still trying to sight point.. and I still have to tell him to whoa once he gets the scent. So perhaps I need to continue with what I am doing for a little longer until he figures that part out. Question for you Jixer: How long did you have to tell bayleigh to WHOA when she caught scent before she began to figure out that the correct response was to do exactly that???

[Jixer]

When are you getting that bird launcher???? :boink:

If you can't get him to learn it now, he'll surely figure it out when bird season starts. Just stay away from those tame birds...
He needs to learn that getting too close to birds will scare them away. If you try to make him point the bird with "Whoa", what are you going to do when he is 100 yards in front? He needs to learn to point those birds himself, and then you can give him a little "whoa" as a reminder.

[Huntingonthebrain]

Awesome. Actually even before I needed the launcher on the first run, we got a big gust of wind and he caught scent and semi pointed. Either way he stopped up. I released the bird even though he was about 15 feet away and he hardly lifted a paw. I am getting pretty excited. Now I just need to find a better place to train. The place I am doing it right now is a little lame, not really that impressed with it. I am so glad that I bought a launcher though. It is already a worthwhile investment:laugh:

[Jixer]

Sounds good. Doesn't sound like he "semi-pointed". If he stops cause he caught scent-----> he IS pointing. Doesn't have to have the leg up or any of that. Keep working him like that, without pressure, and his style/intensity will look after itself. He's a good dog from good lines. He will get it. He has pretty good drive, and that in itself will take you a long ways.

[Huntingonthebrain]

Last night, Chris and I took Machaceh and Sheena out to Gold Creek. And despite what Chris might tell you... I think he has a better understanding about dog training then he says he does. Anyway, we got Mac on a couple of birds and he still wants go when they are flushed but he is definetely starting to stop up when he catches scent. That being said I still have him on a check cord when doing this. I think he might just go and bump the bird and flush it still if he was not on the check cord. I figure a few more times out and I try it without the check cord once just to see what happens. I will also at that point make sure I have the launcher ready to let loose if he does bust in on one. The best part is that my dog loves to hunt and he does have some natural ability and drive. When we let him go he spent a good chunk of the time running through the long grass sniffing around. You know that the dog is hunting when he continues to roam around in a spot for a period of time sniffing the area and trying to find where that scent is coming from.

I also learned that my dog is a swimmer last night. As some of you will remember from another post, I was worried about this. Well the worry is gone. If I remember correctly, Mac saw Sheena on the other side of the pond at one point and decided he wanted to go see her. So he jumped in and swam across. I was so excited. He also retrieved a stick a couple of times for me (though I perhaps have to work on the actual "retreiving right to me" part). He swam for about 20 minutes I guess. I will confess I was worried for a bit because I had heard that swimming is probably one of the weakest skills of a brittany.

Sheena is a nice dog. Beautiful and a great tempermant. Chris worked her on a bird as well. SHE LOVES BIRDS! In fact later on in the evening we let the dogs go for a good run out by the pond. Sheena chased a bird on land, then jumped in the pond and swam after it. Chris was pretty excited about this too as he said that Sheena was not afraid of the water but had never really spent this much time on her own in the water. The great thing was that both dogs decided to do it on their own.

Chris gave me some great tips last night and I think I am going to work really hard on quartering for the next little while and perhaps also the WHOA post. My dog is ok at "WHOA" but I need to staunch him up for wing and shot. Anyway, I hope that these little updates encourage others that are learning to do this as well.

[Jixer]

Sounds like it is going well.:spoton:
Rather than running him without the checkcord, I would let him drag it as an intermediate step.

[andrew06]

Hunting on the brain - I think we are running neck and neck through this training race.. haha Seems like we are at the same point with our pointers.. Im beginning the transition of checkcord to off leash as well. This week actually I tried off leash & it wasnt too bad, my GSP wants to take a step or 2 towards the scent but he's holding point decent, still some work to do but how fun would it be to have nothing to work on!!! Andrew

[Sharon]

This is not how I train Andre, but if it works for you that's all that matters. Glad you're enjoying yourself.

[ChrisGSP]

Glad to help you HOTB, we'll have to do it again sometime soon, Just have to figure out what else to do next.

[andrew06]

Thanks Case, I definatly enjoy myself.

[Huntingonthebrain]

To bad you are not in Ontario Andrew. You could have joined Chris and I on thursday

[andrew06]

That would be good! From the progress you seem to be making I could benefit from that training for sure.

[ChrisGSP]

do you live anywhere near St Martins, NB?

[andrew06]

Im about a 3 hour drive from there.

[ChrisGSP]

I was there 2 summers ago on my honeymoon, Plan to go back next summer. Beutiful province NB

[Huntingonthebrain]

Funny that Chris, I installed a computer system in St. Martin at the True Value/Gas/Grocery store in town there a couple of years back

[ChrisGSP]

That's about all there is in St martins. Thats also the video store aswell. My wifes aunt owns a house on the top of the hill there. Buetiful place to be... if its not foggy

[Huntingonthebrain]

it was pretty much to cold when I was there for there to be any fog. It was a beautiful place though. I am so totally off the topic of this thread right now... I am just waiting for someone to give me the ":offtopic2:" emoticon. Hehe. :sorry: NOT!!!!!

[ChrisGSP]

Who's going to do that? You and I are the only ones here.

[andrew06]

Good sea duck hunting down around there!!
I like NB too. :offtopic2:

[Huntingonthebrain]

Chris you stand corrected.... hehe still :offtopic2: .

[dilly]

H.O.T.B. Since we are off topic anyway, how do you pronounce your dogs name? I need it spelled phonetically...its been stumping me for over a month now! :der: :bigrin
Steve

[ChrisGSP]

MA-CAS-AH not sure what it means but I believe it is hebrew.

oh, HOTB is away this weekend.

[dilly]

Thanks Chris, the mystery is solved...LOL

[Huntingonthebrain]

Yes Hebrew for "hope" or more accurately "refuge". My wife and I figured we would be hard pressed to have a dog that is similarily named with this and it has some meaning for us as well. We lost our first brittany after 2 weeks...and we just kept trusting God to help us through it. He was our hope and refuge during that time. So we named our second brittany Machaceh to always remind us.

[dilly]

Nice name....nice dog too

[Huntingonthebrain]

It was like a switch being turned on. He just started to point.. birds, scents, squirrels etc. It was not sight point either in most case.. it was scent. The greatest part was that he would actually stay for about 5-7 seconds most times as well. So I need to work on keeping him there.. but he knows now that this is what I want him to do. every once in a while a nice little thing like this happens and you think.. my dog is starting to get it. Sweet!!! I think I might try allowing him to go on his own dragging a check cord to see what happens. He is working close enough at this point that I think I could get to him before his 5-7 sec point is finished. Then I could pet him up and hopefully increase his steadiness a bit

[Jixer]

How is his "whoa" coming? If he understands the "whoa" command, you can always remind him with it when you are building up his steadiness.

[Huntingonthebrain]

actually that is exactly what I have been doing Jix. His Whoa is pretty great in my opinion now. I have not tested how long he will go with a whoa. I do know this, he flushed a rabbit a couple of weeks back and started to give chase towards a road. I told him WHOA and he stopped up pretty quick and waited for the release command to start moving again. Awesome control of the dog with that command.. it is a saving grace in some situations. I am pretty happy about it

[Sharon]

You should be very happy about that. Whoaing when he's chasing a rabbit is a level many dogs never get to. Well done, Jeremy.

[Huntingonthebrain]

Thanks Sharon.. I will give this disclaimer though. I am not sure he would do that everytime yet. But I am working on that. He also did the same thing with a cat one day. This cat looked sick... maybe even rabid. He made the cat and started to head towards it. SO I whoa'ed him up real quick. I so wasn't interested in the aftermath of that one.... Rabies vaccination or not. What has been really exciting is that I have not been using an E-collar to re-enforce the whoa off leash yet. The collar has been on.. but I have not being giving him a zap with it for that.

[be2man]

Sounds like he's coming along well. I'd avoid the use of the e collar around birds at this point. I would keep the yard work and the bird work in parallel but separate until he's had lots bird exposure. You've got lots of time to steady him up. Lots of bird exposure and chances to learn without pressure will keep him stylish. I found it hard with my first Britt not to try to move to fast and expect to much from a young dog. Enjoy puppyhood. He'll have lots of time to be a serious adult.

[Huntingonthebrain]

Had him out today. Decided to keep him on leash, but not to hold it. He pointed both birds (leg up and tail straight out). The one point was done from over 40 yards away and out of sight. He waited for me to show up. When I released the bird from the launcher...he stayed.. looked at the bird but did not move. As I said this happened with both birds. I am going to keep him doing it like this for a bit. I think this is my next stage with him:clap2: :clap2: :clap2: I am a happy man. Time to go give him a bath.

[andrew06]

Thats awesome!!! Nice time to be showing progress with hunting season coming sooner every day. Andrew

[Jixer]

Sounds like you'll be fine for hunting season....!:nice work:

[Huntingonthebrain]

Last night I made another transition. Mac is now completely off leash when hunting birds.... no trailing check cord. Last night I let him go and he stopped 3 birds really well. Very minimal creeping. A little handling work and hopefully on some real pheasants he will start to retrieve. Looks like I might have a dog to hunt over. Very Pleased. It was nice to meet you last night as well Spear. Trigger is great dog.. lots of drive... a little work and he will be awesome

[Sharon]

Congrats. on your hard work.
What birds was he solid on? I'm having a heck of a time transitioning mine to pheasant. Is he steady to shot? You want to have a safe hunt.

The Exeter Game Farm will have pheasants next week if you want to do some pheasant work under a controlled situation

[Huntingonthebrain]

Congrats. on your hard work.
What birds was he solid on? I'm having a heck of a time transitioning mine to pheasant. Is he steady to shot? You want to have a safe hunt.

The Exeter Game Farm will have pheasants next week if you want to do some pheasant work under a controlled situation

He is pretty solid on pigeons... I have not had him on pheasants though he is familiar with that scent when I put it on bumpers in the past. what is exeter gonna charge to do that???

[Spear]

Yes, it was good to meet you guys last night. Thanks for all the help with my dog. Trigger was really out of sorts last night and controlling that incessant drive to run is going to be a challenge. I think the key will be lots of exposure. I was surprised at his poor work actually since last year I hunted him with showing off great pointing and no creeping. I think your suggestion of working the whoa post with him will be a good thing to do.

[Sharon]

He is pretty solid on pigeons... I have not had him on pheasants though he is familiar with that scent when I put it on bumpers in the past. what is exeter gonna charge to do that???

A bird is not a bird, for most dogs. Each scent is different and each action is different. A pheasant can explode out of the cover like no other bird and can send even the best trained dog into a tail spin. Best to transition from pigeon to chukar ( and quail for trial folks) , to pheasant.

I'm picking up chukar this week @ $10. a piece. I think pheasant might be $15. a bird at least , but you can take them home for dinner. There's no cheap way to have a well-trained dog.

[warren]

Huntonbrain,
A pup whoaing while chasing a rabbit. That is absolutley awsome.

Sharon,
How many of those $10 and $15 dollar birds do you reckon you go through in a years training. It might make a winger seem cheap. :bigrin

[Sharon]

I'm not sure what you mean by a winger. I thought they projected artificial /dead birds? Don't know much about retriever tools. I do use a launcher for facilitating backing and stop to a wild flush. But you can't make a bird dog without LOTS of birds. There are no shortcuts. Unfortunately we don't have year round wild birds to work here like so many of my friends in the States. Nothing can take the place of a real running, circling pheasant or the flush of a real chukar.

From pup to shooting dog ( 15 months) , I probably go through roughly 100 pigeons ( 6 months), 60 quail (4 months) 60 chukar ( 4 months) and 20 pheasant ( 6 weeks) ...$1500. This is assuming everything goes as planned. You're not going to tell my husband are you? LOL

[TK'S]

Sharron if you are looking for cheeper birds let me know I think I can help you out and there not that far. Terry

[Huntingonthebrain]

A bird is not a bird, for most dogs. Each scent is different and each action is different. A pheasant can explode out of the cover like no other bird and can send even the best trained dog into a tail spin. Best to transition from pigeon to chukar ( and quail for trial folks) , to pheasant.

I'm picking up chukar this week @ $10. a piece. I think pheasant might be $15. a bird at least , but you can take them home for dinner. There's no cheap way to have a well-trained dog.

Where do you get them from??? I could use a couple of chukar for my dog next

[Huntingonthebrain]

Sharron if you are looking for cheeper birds let me know I think I can help you out and there not that far. Terry

I am interested in cheap birds terry.

[Huntingonthebrain]

So my latest news is this. I took Mac to Hullet this week since I was camping nearby. I had never been there. It was beautiful. Mac pointed a couple of birds. Never found them, but he definetly found something. We saw the people who were trialing.. they were a little ways away. Here are some pictures

http://www.mnsi.net/~jkmales/hullet_upland.jpg

http://www.mnsi.net/~jkmales/hidden_mac.jpg

http://www.mnsi.net/~jkmales/hullet_marshland.jpg

Sorry for the quality of the last one. I think this was a white heron. I have never seen one this colour and I had to go to the extent of my optical and digital zoom to get it this close. Anyone want to chime in as to what it is. As I said looks like a heron to me.

http://www.mnsi.net/~jkmales/white_heron.jpg

We also saw some black looking ducks and a multitude of Canada poopers as well. :dog: :laugh: :rockon:

[Sharon]

Sharron if you are looking for cheeper birds let me know I think I can help you out and there not that far. Terry

Thank you Terry. Can you PM me the info.?

Got a third to-day out of 10 dogs. Dog did a remarkable job on relocating a pheasant. Whole process ( finding, relocating, gunshot) took 15 minutes. She's a 27 pound setter with a heart that weighs 20 pounds I'm sure.

[Huntingonthebrain]

So I just got a response from Hullett about the bird picture I posted yesterday. It is a great egret. Apparently it is one of the species at risk that they are watching. Very cool. Just a little smaller than a great blue heron

[Jixer]

Great pictures HOTB. It is great to have a place like Hullet for help wildlife at risk regain a foothold. I hope that you took a good look around. Bird season is coming....


Congrats Case.:third:

[dilly]

great pics. Thanks for posting

[Huntingonthebrain]

Mac is now starting to retrieve. He put 2 birds right in my hand today. I am so excited again. His points are great and he is still breaking a little on wing and shot...but over all his handling is getting better. I am most excited about the retrieving though. This was on a chukar as well which is a new bird for him.

[Jixer]

Looks like you are in for a good season hunting over your own dog. What else could you ask for! :):nice work:

[Huntingonthebrain]

I am getting pretty excited Jim. He ain't perfect yet...but I have trained him myself...with some really great help and I have something to be proud of. Now if I can just get me some birds I will be even happier.

[Huntingonthebrain]

He points, he holds (for the most part) and now he is retrieving as well. In the last couple of weeks he has started to quarter a little bit at my whistle. I know it ain't a silent command.. but its a start. I am going to take him on his first Pheasant hunt next week. Will let you know how it goes.