Fix Pets Or Be Fined

[Huntmaster]

California new bill is to pass a bylaw that pet owners have to have their pets neutered or be fined $500.
Say good by to Lassie! Bob Barker has his big mouth in this, I thought that old fart retired. The reason they are putting so many dogs down, is because to own a rescue dog or adopted one, you have to sell your soul. Its way easier to go to a pet store and by one, then to go threw all the paper work and very personal questioning the humane society and rescue groups put you threw. I think this new bill will only create bigger problem's, such as: The pet owners that cant afford to get their pet or pets fixed will have no choice but to abandon them, meaning more dogs for the humane Society to put down. The vets will get rich and the tax payers will be hit hard (this bill has no funding, not even from good old BOB!!) so who will pay. A lot of good breeds like police dogs, seeing eye dogs and even Lassie will be targeted. I think pets up for adoption should be neutered, as they are 80% of the over population due to ignorance by owners that get a pet and not understanding the responsibilities that come with it. You would be surprised of the people that adopted a pet because they thought they wanted one, and after a week of clean up, chewed up shoes and food cost" they open the door and let the pet free to breed as it wishes.
I'm down will this bill, and wish there was something we could do before it spreads to here. Anyone got any ideas? :angry:

I also think there should be more pressure on puppy mills! (sorry Kevin, I said that word again,,lol).

[Tim]

I read about this bill on RTF, and it missed the mark. I think that the problem with the over population needs to be addressed by the CKC/AKC with the gov't to come up with legislation to reduce it, not by AR groups.
I think the CKC/AKC should propose legislation requiring that vet's spay or nueter dogs that are not registered, which would start to reduce the potential breeding pool.
Being proactive in dealing with this problem would be a benefit to all of us that don't want the AR people getting involved first, which from what I read happened in California and is happening elsewhere.
Another problem would be how to enlighten the public about pet stores and BYB's, and the major role they have played in this problem before all dog owners/breeders are lumped together with those less respectable "kennels"
I am only throwing this out there, and there are probably better ideas, but it is something that will be coming to a town near you, soon.
As always this is JMHO
Tim

[Huntingonthebrain]

Lets face it. Puppy Mills are a big problem. By this I mean business that breed dogs just for money and don't value the breed standards etc. This puts all sorts of animals into mix. Many of which are sub par in terms of breeding. And a lot of people don't get'em fixed either. I agree. I think that non registered dogs should FIXED and if they are not fixed.. FINE em. No doubt. I agree

[Huntmaster]

Huntingonthebrain and Tim, Nice try but not fair to dog breeders that cant registered there breed because its not recognized by the CKC or AKC and so on. And I would be damned if I would give these guy the power to dictate to pet owners all over the world. There are several breeds out there that are high in demand such as the Labradoodle's, puggle's ect,,, These dog run between $900-$1200 and some more. Why can we or the Government, demand these dog to be neutered. I'm sure other breeds will be accepted in the CKC when the time and demand is right. Neutering every dog or pet that cant be registered is dictation and selfish, I think even GOD would agree to this! WE have no right"! NO there has to be another way, and never leave it up to an organization that is out to make money! I watch a show on TV about the worlds most ugliest dog. There was thousands of dog owners that entered. Trust me NO PUREBRED'S, but there wasn't a owner there that wasn't proud as a peacock.

I remember a story about a boy that had a mutt dog that he trained to hunt coons, the dog ended up winning a huge event, I think Walt Disney made a movie of it.

As far as I'm concerned, the ones trying to pass this bill are nothing but a bunch of pencil pushers, that don't have a clue to want they are doing,,,,, OH" OH" there are to many poor dogs being put down, LETS have them all NEUTERED"". STUPID,,stupid,,stupid,,,

Im not meaning you Huntingonthebrain and Tim, just the pincil pusher's!!

[Tim]

Huntingonthebrain and Tim, Nice try but not fair to dog breeders that cant registered there breed because its not recognized by the CKC or AKC and so on. And I would be damned if I would give these guy the power to dictate to pet owners all over the world. There are several breeds out there that are high in demand such as the Labradoodle's, puggle's ect,,, These dog run between $900-$1200 and some more. Why can we or the Government, demand these dog to be neutered. I'm sure other breeds will be accepted in the CKC when the time and demand is right. Neutering every dog or pet that cant be registered is dictation and selfish, I think even GOD would agree to this! WE have no right"! NO there has to be another way, and never leave it up to an organization that is out to make money! I watch a show on TV about the worlds most ugliest dog. There was thousands of dog owners that entered. Trust me NO PUREBRED'S, but there wasn't a owner there that wasn't proud as a peacock.

I remember a story about a boy that had a mutt dog that he trained to hunt coons, the dog ended up winning a huge event, I think Walt Disney made a movie of it.

As far as I'm concerned, the ones trying to pass this bill are nothing but a bunch of pencil pushers, that don't have a clue to want they are doing,,,,, OH" OH" there are to many poor dogs being put down, LETS have them all NEUTERED"". STUPID,,stupid,,stupid,,,

Im not meaning you Huntingonthebrain and Tim, just the pincil pusher's!!

I have to agree with a few points you have made, especially the "pencil pushers", which is why I think it is best to be pro-active and be involved before it becomes a media circus and politicians start taking advise from the AR groups, because it will happen here. If you think it won't then you should remember the spring bear hunt, all the BS about orphaned cubs and such, pure hype for media attention.
I would not support the gov't having the authority to stop someone from getting a mutt, labradoodle, or whatever, have had them myself, enjoyed their company as much as my current dawg.
The problems will start with a few generations of these crosses being bred with each other, I see it first hand here in Windsor with all the pit/rottie/presa cross breedings with labs/shepherds..., it's breeding without any indication of what the pups temperment will be like, and these pups grow up and get labeled as viscous due to there breeding and training- or lack of training, then the do-gooders and pencil pushers get together and ban a breed, not the breeder.
If someone wants a designer dog, fine, cross a purebred with a purebred and alter the pups.
Sorry for the long post
Tim

[Huntingonthebrain]

I knew you were not out to get me with that Huntmaster. I guess am more concerned with animals that are not going to be loved (because of over abundance) and with the quality of the animals being bred. I really am not against anyone having a cross bred dog or even animals that are not neutered. My point is very similar to what you have said Huntmaster in that people who are only interested in money are going to just breed whatever to make a buck and then as you have said we end up with animals being put down and humane societies and animal services with piles of animals they do not know what to do with. I also agree that you do have to sell your soul to even get one. My wife and I had to sign all these waivers and instructions when we got our cat from the Humane Society (we went there because we knew that there were plenty of animals that needed a good home already without going to a pet store). As with most things one of the real problems is essentially $$$$$. People only care about it and not the animals. Whatever can be done to make a buck. Believe me when I say that legislation is not my first choice for anything simply because the government is not capable of regulating anything with any real effectiveness. I don't have any ideas either of how to deal with it. I guess my other question is. If a person is buying an animal and not going to be using the animal for breeding purposes why not make fixing that animal manditory? My opinion is that if I own a dog or a cat I am responsible for making sure that when that animal is out and about that it is also not procreating. What are your thoughts on these ideas??

[Huntmaster]

Huntingonthebrain, Yes I agree people should have their pets spayed or neutered, but I don't agree that any Government or organization should have the right to force you to. I just called my vet to ask the price to have a dog neutered, and she said it went by weight, but the average was around $215.00. That's a lot of money for a young boy to shell out, and if Dad wont or cant pay, I guess the pup has to go! I bought a Daisy air rifle a couple days ago to use while training my dog. What to get her use to seeing me with one so there are no surprises when we go to hunt test. As I was walking threw a hayfield with my Lab and Daisy, I thought, this seem familiar! 40 years ago I walked these same fields with my Daisy in hand and my dear friend ( an old egg sucking Mutt) I loved very much. I hope you get my point!

Tim, I agree with some of what you said, and I think pit-bull and rotties should be keep in junk yards, not play grounds. But only breeding purebred with a purebred is pessimism talk. I had a Lab & Sheppard mix, as a boy, my Dad gave it to the local OPP station. Our school class went to the Station for an outing to see what a jail was like. There was a book with pictures, in that book I seen two pictures of my Lab & Sheppard mix (mutt), one was him biting at a cop with padding on and the other was him jumping over a fence in training. I know it was my dog because of a dropped ear he had. When I told my Dad he admitted to giving the dog to them. I guess my mutt was good enough to be an officer of the law. I hope you get my point! YES this was a true story!

[Huntingonthebrain]

well said huntmaster

[Tim]

Huntmaster,
I guess we can agree to disagree on some things.
For the record though I don't have an issue with pit's or rotties, just the unethical people who continue to breed and train dogs that are "crazy", for lack of a better term. I may be off base thinking that requiring spay/neuter would slow the expansion of these dogs, but something has to be done. The reason I suggest CKC/AKC is because the majority of people would recognize these organizations and their position would have legitimacy with the general public.
Breed specific legislation is what we get when politicians try to solve this problem, that is why I think getting involved before it becomes an issue is important.
Regardless, I respect your opinion and enjoy the debate.
:stirpot:
Tim

[Huntmaster]

Jim, I respect your opinion and enjoy the debate also, and I DO have a problem with pit's and rotties (crazy dogs) They became popular with criminals that wanted to keep the police from busting their stash or addicts from busting there door in the steal a fix and there large unaccounted for, money stash. But there are bylaws on breeding and owning these breeds in some places, and growing. So something is being done!
The reason I don't think CKC/AKC should get involved with this bill, unless it is to appose the bill, which I very much doubt. these are money making organization, it would be in there best interest to have unregistered dogs fixed. Meaning people would soon have to buy a registered pet if they intend to own one. Talk about a chance to funnel your customers. I think CKC/AKC have a conflict of interest in this matter. Which means its up to us and all unregistered pet owners! :stirpot: :bigrin

[Huntmaster]

California Sportsmen Stop Bill to End Dog Breeding
Sportsmen's pressure pays off in California

July 11, 2007 (California)



(Sacramento) - California sportsmen have derailed legislation that would have outlawed the breeding of accomplished sporting dogs and eventually made it impossible to breed and own hunting dogs.



On July 11, AB 1634 was pulled from the Senate Local Government Committee agenda after the bill’s sponsor, Assemblyman Lloyd Levine, D-Van Nuys, realized it did not have enough support to pass. The bill, which cannot be considered again during this legislative session, requires dogs over six months to be spayed or neutered. It provides exemptions only for licensed breeders and a handful of purebred animals that meet rigid qualifications. It provides no protection for sportsmen who hunt over mixed breed dogs.



Assembly Bill 1634 will cause unnecessary financial hardships on middle and low income sportsmen who will be forced to spay or neuter their animals.



“Sportsmen’s pressure on California lawmakers has helped protect hobby breeders and hunting interests, but the fight is not over” said Rob Sexton, USSA vice president for government affairs. “Assemblyman Levine has vowed to spend the next six months garnering support for Assembly Bill 1634. Sportsmen must be prepared to continue the fight in 2008.”



The USSA worked with key national and local sportsmen’s groups and dog organizations to drum up grassroots action and defeat the measure. California Houndsmen for Conservation, California Outdoor Heritage Alliance, Masters of Foxhounds Association of America and PetPAC are among the organizations that helped raise awareness, motivate hunters to action, and raise funds to defeat the bill.



In 2006, the USSA worked with California sportsmen to protect hunting interests by blocking a bill that threatened hunting dog competitors and field coursers. Three years earlier, it worked with partners in the state to defeat legislation that would have banned bear hunting, fox hunting, rabbit hunting, raccoon hunting and more.



The U.S. Sportsmen’s Alliance is a national association of sportsmen and sportsmen’s organization that protects the rights of hunters, anglers and trappers in the courts, legislatures, at the ballot, in Congress and through public education programs. For more information about the U.S. Sportsmen’s Alliance and its work, call (614) 888-4868 or visit its website, www.ussportsmen.org.

:clap2: :bf_new: :bf_new: :bf_new: :clap2: :clap2: