One of my dogs has stopped doing doubles..

[Debbie C]

Hey guys.
My female has me baffled. She has been doing doubles quite successfully, and all of the sudden she stopped. She would mark the birds both very well, go for the first one like a bat out o' hell and then when I would line her up for he second bird, she would start bouncing around, bop my hands with her nose, sometimes bark. I call her to heel, line her up and she would take a step or two and then look at me as if to say...WHAT THE %$#@ are ya askin me to do lady...

I knew I had a few holes to fill in, so I was backtracking, and was doing TT for a while, but in my ignorance, there wasn't much for marks. Time was limited, so I figured it was better then doing nothing, so alot of the days was just yard work, plus I work alone here and rounding up the niece and nefew can be a chore sometimes....so I am not sure if that had anything to do with it, but ...(what the heck do I know...)

so I have tried to start her over on doubles. Start at the corner of the house, toss one then the other and then both....nice flat ground. She will get the doubles if I throw or place them and come back to her side, but haveing someone else toss them, and she turns into a retard for the second bird. I am not sure how much further I can backtrack. and it is totally frustrating because I am not sure if I did something to stop her and even more frustrated that I can't figure out how to get her back on track. it actually puts a lump in my throat (i am such a baby...)

Any suggestions from you guys would be more then appreciated. I was told not to worry about it right now and keep doing the yard work and singles, but give her challenges with the singles.
My older dog is doing well, but I can't use too much pressure on him. He is a softy.

Debbie.

[3 black dogs]

Deb you have back trcked properly but have someone throw longer mark that the dog is capable of doing and you toss the short one. pick up the short one them line the dog up on the long one and if she is not looking out get the gunner to hey-hey and throw another bumper. also you could peper the area of the fall with bumpers so she is sucsessfull quickly with out a big hunt and starts to relearn to count. it sounds like a confidence issue. just keep build her up with no preasure.

Chris

[Debbie C]

thanks...I haven't tried that one yet. I'll give it a shot tomorrow.

[just chessies]

Hi Deb some times it hard to give advice on a dog over the forum but for whats it,s worth have your thrower on the first/memory bumper throw it then throw another one right after the first one to the same spot then have another person throw the second bumper all this is done on short grass, if dog has a problem with going on memory bumper signal the thrower to wave his arm with a hey,hey to get the dogs attention all throws should be wide nothing to tight, just my 2 cent,s worth have a nice day training Marv. Calhoun:dog: :dog: :dog:

[captainjack]

If you are not using a collar program, I would suggest birds, birds, birds. Try a dead bird on the go bird and a live pigeon on the memory bird. Start in short grass and then progress to cover. Shot flyers or shackled pigeons will bring out the desire in your dog - we sometimes forget that these are bird dogs and do too much work with bumpers. Bumpers are fine in the yard, but birds are necessary in the field or your field work just becomes more yard work and this will turn your dog off.

If you are using a collar program, I would suggest that you revist force to the pile and be prepared to use a step up nick on the memory bird - again in short cover.

[Debbie C]

I do use a collar and when I do the back nick back, she still does the same thing. I am limited to the birds I have access to. I have about 6 in the freezer, but had to buy them used from a previous test. I work alone here, so there are no clubs, shackled birds or other trainers. I do have a couple of kids that like to make a couple of bucks, but they are young and spend alot of time horsing around in the field, so the dogs are not always successful at actually seeing a bird go down.....(gotta teach that boy how to throw) I even added white ribbon to a few of the bumpers so they would see them a bit better to make up for the fact that neither of them can throw. It doesn't seem to help with the doubles, but I'm gonna keep plugging along. I'm gonna take a couple of birds out and see if that gets their blood flowing any.

thanks again.

[captainjack]

Deb,

I was taught on no goes or bugging to nick forward ie. step forward with here command and nick forward and send, so the procedure is - "here", nick while stepping forward, and send . I was also taught to treat pops as no goes and to recall and use the same procedure as above ie. here, nick, send. The timing on "back", nick, "back" is one of the hardest to perform and most confusing to the dog if the timing is not correct and I prefer not to use it without some supervision.
There are plenty of pros or experienced amateurs that are willing to help if you can make the time to visit them. It sounds like a good two week holiday training with a pro would be time well spent. Many will take you on as a day client and spend some quality time with you. You may have to throw alot of birds, and pay a training fee, but it is time and money well spent.
As a previous person has said, it is hard to give advice over the internet without seeing the dog, but my advice is to try to get someone with good knowledge to see what is going on with your dog. It is the only sound way to get proper advice.

[Debbie C]

thanks guys. I'll give this a try. Actually,in a few days, I'll be heading down to Wisconsin with both the dogs, to another Ladies Retreat with Kristie Wilder. I'm hoping to pick her brain as much as possible while I am down there. The last one I went to in Mississippi, was awsome. I was probably the junior-est dog there and the only one that didn't have a pro trainer on speed dial or access to one. It was avery knowledgeable and was great to hang out with the big dogs. they were all wonderful in answering all my questions, so I am sure I'll be picking their brains too!! I am sure some one will be able to point out a few things I need to adjust and I am looking forward to that.

I'll keep ya all posted.

[Kevin Hannah]

Have a good trip, the updates on RTF sound like they are a lot of fun.

Kevin

[Drew Good]

I second Kevin, they have always sounded like alot of fun. Enjoy your trip, I am sure you will get lots of good advice....

Drew

[Kevin Hannah]

Hopefully you will have a recap of the weekend and maybe some pictures for us when you get back.

Kevin

[just chessies]

Drive safe and have a good trip

[Debbie C]

Thanks guys. I'll definetely give a recap of the weekend and post as many pictures as I can when I get back. I wasn't able to take hardly any pictures last time, as you are pretty busy all day when you are there, But our photographer Chip Laughton took a bundle. Man, can he ever take pictures... I think I 'll be counting on him again this time too...:bigrin


talk to you soon.